Author Topic: Should battlecruisers be used for solo LV 4 Missions?  (Read 7532 times)

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Lavos

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Should battlecruisers be used for solo LV 4 Missions?
« on: May 19, 2008, 10:45:04 am »
I need to hear more opinions out there. Personal preference aside,  do you think people should rely on battleships for lv 4 missions, or could battlecruisers be as effective if set up correctly? Would it benefit new characters to jump into a battlecruiser and start lv 4's asap?

ZMaster

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Re: Should battlecruisers be used for solo LV 4 Missions?
« Reply #1 on: May 19, 2008, 10:50:33 am »
Drakes and Myrms can solo any Lvl IV out there,  it just takes a bit longer than for example with a Nighthawk or an Ishtar.
Dunno about Harbinger, Cane or the Tier 1 BCs ...
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delindsay

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Re: Should battlecruisers be used for solo LV 4 Missions?
« Reply #2 on: May 19, 2008, 10:57:29 am »
Should a BC be able to solo a LvL 4 100%, prolly not. Can a BC solo ALL LvL 4's 100%, no. There are a few (2-5) LvL 4's that have BS's with a very good tank and a BC setup to tank a LvL 4 cannot output the damage needed to break those few BS's. I'm lucky and have a 2nd account that is pure fighter so I always have available help. Then I can bring that account with me (one room behind me) to salvage while I'm killing the next room. Makes for super high efficiency.

EDIT: The reality of it is CCP created LvL 4's to be completed with your Corp mates or a small gang, NOT to be solo'd be uber passive shield tanks like my Myrm.
« Last Edit: May 19, 2008, 10:59:50 am by delindsay »
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ZMaster

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Re: Should battlecruisers be used for solo LV 4 Missions?
« Reply #3 on: May 19, 2008, 11:23:47 am »
You can indeed solo ALL Lvl IVs with a Drake or a Myrm, i know that for a fact.
Even Rachen Mysuna is killable with a Drake or a Myrm with 5x T2 Heavies :)
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delindsay

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Re: Should battlecruisers be used for solo LV 4 Missions?
« Reply #4 on: May 19, 2008, 01:42:21 pm »
Quote
5x T2 Heavies

B4 Trinity that would hold true, now with bandwidth that isn't the case. Hoborack Moon (BS in last room of The Assault I think) has a tank that exceeds any tanking BC's damage output post Trinity. It's somewhere north of 500 DPS. And without all 5x Ogre II + Guns it's just not possible. I run LvL 4's exclusively with my Myrm and there are as I said 2-5 that I alone can't break the BS tank in the last room. Another mission comes to mind has 3x $1+ mil Ravens that orbit at 50-60km in the last room. They also are nearly impossible to drop solo BC style. This is with a Drake/Myrm passive shield (super tank - low dps out) mission fit. If I killed all but that 1 or so BS, came back with all Blasters/Drones and armor tanking I could solo just that ship but that involves alot of lost time refitting for 1 or so NPC.
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ZMaster

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Re: Should battlecruisers be used for solo LV 4 Missions?
« Reply #5 on: May 19, 2008, 01:52:29 pm »
oh ffs ... sorry i haven´t flown a myrm in ages and simply forgot that it got nerfed, too.
noob mistake :P
k, nvm then
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HraTaika

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Re: Should battlecruisers be used for solo LV 4 Missions?
« Reply #6 on: May 20, 2008, 06:47:06 am »
I was kinda wondering should a new player go directly for battlecruisers, skipping BS and normal cruisers?


Oh and Subdubg (or however it was spelled) if you happen to read this could you post a new "standard" loadout for the Omen as the old one is outdated? ^^ (would have send you a PM but I can't yet)

Prideful

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Re: Should battlecruisers be used for solo LV 4 Missions?
« Reply #7 on: May 20, 2008, 07:00:35 am »
You need to be able to fly normal cruisers to be able to fly battlecruisers and battleships. This is what i suggest;
Learn to fly a cruiser, then learn to use t2 defenses (i.e. invul field ii)
Use this cruiser for ratting or level 2 missions
When you can use t2 defense mods then move up to a B/C or a B/S for level 3s and 4s. I suggest a BC for 3s and BS for 4s. Doing 4s with a BC is possible, but it takes alot longer then with a BS.
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fastcart

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Re: Should battlecruisers be used for solo LV 4 Missions?
« Reply #8 on: May 20, 2008, 07:42:26 am »
Not to argue with Prideful, but on my second character (Caldari) I skipped cruiser and went directly for Drake.  A lot of skills between the Caracal and Drake overlapped.  The Drake is ridiculous in that you don't need a lot of SPs to do all of the lvl 3 missions (provided you know what you're doing in missions).

Minimum skill for Drake, plus heavy missiles, Energy Grid Upgrade (for shield relays), Shield Upgrade (for shield rechargers and extenders), and Tactical Shield Manipulation (for active hardener) takes 4-7 days depending on skills.  Then, you can train drones on top of that.  With that, you should be ok for everything but Blockade.  The once you train tech 2s, you can do Blockade w/o issues.

Whatever you do, DON'T POST YOUR DRAKE LOADOUT.  (:  Of course the OP is asking about lvl 4s, but I couldn't let Prideful's comment go. d:
« Last Edit: May 20, 2008, 07:44:29 am by fastcart »

HraTaika

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Re: Should battlecruisers be used for solo LV 4 Missions?
« Reply #9 on: May 20, 2008, 08:19:57 am »
Actually yeah,
I could go directly to battleships, seeing that they don't require other than cruiser (IV) and some other minor things.

Other than that, the skills I'll learn during the 'required' cruiser period help me with the BS. Hmm.. though getting the money might be a bit more complicated. What do you say about it Prideful?

Or actually why shouldn't I do it? Any big issues that I don't see?

adamantine

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Re: Should battlecruisers be used for solo LV 4 Missions?
« Reply #10 on: May 20, 2008, 08:58:03 am »
Going directly to BS presents a few issues. 
ISK, you will need to have the isk to be able to buy and fit the BS which is hard to do for a new player if he does not get into running lvl III missions which normaly requires a BC. 
player skill, yes you can get into a BS very quickly but you need to understand how to fly it effectively or you will probably end up losing it due to player error and that is a big loss for a new low skill pilot.
Can it be done yes,  Would i recomend it no.  You can effectively work your way through cruiser, then bc then BS and still get into lvl IV missions effectively in about 3 or 4 months if you focus your skills on tanking and the minimal needed for DPS.   tanking is the key to PVE so as long as you can tank it, then the rest will come as your skills grow.

unipeter

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Re: Should battlecruisers be used for solo LV 4 Missions?
« Reply #11 on: May 21, 2008, 10:47:56 am »
i would do level 3's with  a battlecruiser if for no other reason than they are faster.

level 3's are pushovers compared to lvl 4's, which will be done considerably faster with a battleship due to dps, despite their lack of speed.

a lot of the battlecruisers are great passive tankers, too. 
the myrm, drake, hurricane all have awesome passive shield tanks, you can tank most all the level 4's out there, but its a matter of lower dps slowing your progress

Doma

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Re: Should battlecruisers be used for solo LV 4 Missions?
« Reply #12 on: May 21, 2008, 12:36:06 pm »
Quote
5x T2 Heavies

 Hoborack Moon (BS in last room of The Assault I think) has a tank that exceeds any tanking BC's damage output post Trinity. It's somewhere north of 500 DPS. And without all 5x Ogre II + Guns it's just not possible.

For Moon switch to minmatar drones and ex ammo and he goes down pretty fast.
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Swift Voyager

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Re: Should battlecruisers be used for solo LV 4 Missions?
« Reply #13 on: May 21, 2008, 12:48:12 pm »
I don't think anyone would argue that the Raven (caldari battleship) is by far the most efficient ship for solo level 4 missions (of course, improved versions of Raven, like Caldari Navy Raven and Golem are better, but they are just improved Ravens). There's no other battleship or battlecruiser that even comes close to the Raven for level 4 missions.
 
If you are strictly talking about level 4 missions, then go straight for the Raven. You can easily get the Drake along the way, since the skills cross over. Use the Drake for level 3 missions till you get skills/money for a Raven.
 
When you get your first Raven and start to solo level 4 missions: Save up all your initial ISK from the missions. Buy and completely fit a backup Raven at your mission headquarters. When you lose your first Raven, the backup will allow you to go back out and complete the mission then loot your own wreck. Never leave yourself in a situation where you don't have a backup mission ship prepared, no matter what level mission you are running. Everyone in Eve loses ships. Also, never forget to fully insure your mission-running ships.
 
The information on the following site will tell you all you ever wanted to know about missions, and more: http://eve-survival.org/
 
Most of the site even works on the in-game browser, maybe all of it.
« Last Edit: May 21, 2008, 12:53:37 pm by Swift Voyager »
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delindsay

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Re: Should battlecruisers be used for solo LV 4 Missions?
« Reply #14 on: May 21, 2008, 01:43:58 pm »
Quote
For Moon switch to minmatar drones and ex ammo and he goes down pretty fast

I do use Minnie Drones but alas Gallente (Myrmidon with Hybrids) cannot use EXP ammo :(
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Inara Subaka

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Re: Should battlecruisers be used for solo LV 4 Missions?
« Reply #15 on: May 21, 2008, 02:37:11 pm »
Back when I was a mission runner, I ran lvl4s in my Drake solo most of the time.  There were a few that I couldn't solo (AE, and Damsel being 2 of them), and I either had a friend help with DPS, or I skipped them and got a new mission.

I had people call me up to help them out with some of their lvl3 storylines because there were neut towers that boned their entire ship (they were in a Harb, and need cap for guns and tank) while I could warp in and get aggro on everything, then sit back and laugh while he picked them apart with a full gank setup on his Harb.

All in all, it depends on what battlecruiser you want to fly, and what your skill set is.  There are some that I wouldn't put in a lvl 4 with a fleet of backup, but that's just me.

Sinulan

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Re: Should battlecruisers be used for solo LV 4 Missions?
« Reply #16 on: May 21, 2008, 02:43:32 pm »
Quote
For Moon switch to minmatar drones and ex ammo and he goes down pretty fast

I do use Minnie Drones but alas Gallente (Myrmidon with Hybrids) cannot use EXP ammo :(

Myrm doesnt have any special bonuses for Hybrid guns, so it doesnt really matter what kind of turret you put on it.

Projectiles are good because u can choose the damage-type, and they dont use capacitor energy. They have other problems, but these benefits might be useful to you.  It doesnt take much time to train for med projectiles, so it might be worth it for you to try.

delindsay

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Re: Should battlecruisers be used for solo LV 4 Missions?
« Reply #17 on: May 21, 2008, 04:17:00 pm »
I have the same skills in both Hybrid and Proj. Hybrid simply do more damage as the Rails (for missions) hit FAR more often than Arties, have a higher DPS (slightly less volley), at the expense of cap (never a problem for me) and no ability to switch out damage types. I ALWAYS switch to mish spec Drones for that extra punch but again I will GUARANTEE that a passive shield Myrm/Drake will not be able to kill the last 1-3 BS's in 2-5 missions no matter if at all LvL 5 skills and using correct damage type ammo/drones. I'm not trying to be argumentative but am very good at LvL 4's in my Myrm and know the specific limits to BC's for LvL 4's (damage output). This is why I original stated that BC's probably should not be able to solo LvL 4's as it was not CCP's intent for that purpose (meant for small gangs for socialization and cooperation).

EDIT: The 'Guarantee...' statement refers to the most efficient mission running in those ships because you could kill all but that last guy, dock/refit and come back guns a blazin (with minimal tank) to kill just that 1x or so BS. The problem with that is you lose a fair amount of time doing so (especially if your a few jumps from your gear) and would just be easier to bring along a buddy at the end to help with DPS.
« Last Edit: May 21, 2008, 04:26:22 pm by delindsay »
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Sinulan

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Re: Should battlecruisers be used for solo LV 4 Missions?
« Reply #18 on: May 21, 2008, 04:57:22 pm »
Hey Delindsay, i wouldve thought my reply was easily seen as basic level stuff. Looking at your 2nd reply, youre obviously beyond the level of not being able to understand ship bonuses. The advice i gave is not immediately obvious for a new plyr, so i thought i would throw it out there.

What i quoted from you gave me the impression that you might not know about this.

Im glad that you do, and that other ppl who are new to EVE might read this and also know about this type of thing.

EDIT: Not to go over and over the same thing(thats y im just editing)...I meant no offense in either post, trying to be helpful is all.
« Last Edit: May 21, 2008, 05:10:32 pm by Sinulan »

delindsay

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Re: Should battlecruisers be used for solo LV 4 Missions?
« Reply #19 on: May 21, 2008, 05:03:44 pm »
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